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Psychoanalysis On and Off the Couch

Jan 26, 2020

"Through the process of mentalization and empathic resonance sharing the child really begins to experience the process of learning, to trust which is absolutely foundational, and begins to count on being valued, begins to count on being listened to, held in mind, reflected back to and ultimately really cared about and loved."


Description: Harvey Schwartz welcomes Kathryn McCormick. Kathryn is an Advanced Psychoanalytic Candidate in both child and adult psychoanalysis at the Seattle Psychoanalytic Society and Institute. She holds a master's in psychology, is a licensed marriage and family therapist, a child mental health specialist and an ethnic minority mental health specialist in the state of Washington for American-Indian and Alaskan Natives. Kathryn has worked for over 20 years on the Tulalip's Tribe reservation in the state of Washington as a clinician and also for the past 10 years as the Administrative Clinical Supervisor of the Child, Youth and Family Mental Wellness Program. For the past three and a half years, she has been the Administrative Clinical Supervisor of the Betty J. Early Learning Academy which is the tribe's birth-to-five center for behavioral health and recovery. In addition to all these activities, Kathryn is also the president of IPSO, the International Psychoanalytic Studies Organization, which has over 2000 members worldwide in over 42 countries.


As you will hear in today's conversation, Kathryn is deeply devoted to the well being of the Tulalip Tribe members and she is deeply involved in Reflective Network Therapy which is a psychoanalytically informed treatment approach developed by Dr. Gilbert Kliman, that is especially well suited Kathryn work at this community.


Key takeaways:

[4:32] Kathryn McCornick talks about the population that she has been working with the community and their clinical challenges.

[7:20] Kathryn talks about starting to use Reflective Network Therapy and the positive reaction of the community.

[10:35] How does the RNT method work?

[13:25] Parents and caregivers also get involved with the teacher and the therapist.

[14:15] RNT is a relationship process and is dynamic.

[15:51] Kathryn McCornick shares a case example.

[18:50] RNT is proving to be a financially stable approach.

[21:17] What brought Kathryn McCornick into this work?

[26:18] Kathryn McCornick talks about her role as the president of IPSO.

[30:05] Mens sana in corpore sano, a healthy mind in a healthy body: working on the gap between body and mind.


Mentioned in this episode:

IPA Off the Couch 

IPSO World

IPSO on Facebook


Recommended Readings:


Kliman, G. (1970) Experimental application of child analysis in a therapeutic nursery. Psan. Stud. Ch. Vol: 30, New York, NY: The New York Times Press.


Kliman, G. (2018) Reflective Network Therapy for Preschoolers with Autism or Posttraumatic Stress disorder. Neuropsychoanalysis August 2018.




Reflective Network Therapy Within Betty JTaylor Early Learning Academy